Hide Glue + Titanium Dioxide

Building/Repair
#1

Hello All

From my experience Old Brown Hide Glue is the best glue I have used for instrument repair and re-skinning. Only problem with this glue - it dries brownish and “sometimes” (more like always) leaves brown traces on the skin due to glue filling up skin pores or making it a bit transparent so the dou frame is visible.
Just curious if anybody tried using Hide Glue with pigments, let say Titanium Dioxide.
I have ordered the pigment already and going to do a test anyway, just wonder if somebody tried it already.

Best regards,
Alexey

#2

Hello Alexey,

I use hide glue too and have the same brown traces showing through the skin, but the severity of the effect is unpredictable. I would love to find a solution/alternative.

Please keep us posted on your findings,

#3

Hi Alexey
I also use Old brown Glue for gluing shamisen kawahari and find it fantastic. The long open time is great and I’ve never had a skin pull away on me.
At one point I got in touch with Patrick Edwards at Old Brown Glue and I think he said that 10% titanium dioxide wouldn’t affect the gluing qualities. Now I could be wrong on that exact number, and I can’t at the moment remember if that was volume or weight (I think maybe volume). I’m sure you could send them an email to get some thoughts from them. I found them to be very helpful and interested. i’m sure they’d be delighted to hear of another shamisen maker using their glue for skin gluing.
For my part, I never ended up using the titanium dioxide as I ended up liking the random transparency that comes from the glue used as it is.
Cheers and all the best!
Would love to hear how it works for you.
Cath

#4

Hello Catherine

Thanks a lot for the information!
I would definitely keep it in mind during testing!

Best regards,
Alexey

#5

So. I finally had a chance to use titanium dioxide as a pigment mixed up with Tilebond Brown Glue. It worked very well and the strength of the glue is not affected. It still “seeps“ thru the skin but because of the titanium dioxide it is more off-white than brownish spots happening from just hide glue.
Definitely an improvement IMHO

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#6

Also, I was looking for an original Noriko glue.
The only one I was able to find is TSP Latte Noriko water based glue used for Table Tennis Blades. I doubt this is the one Kyle mentioning for Tsugaru skinning. This one white and dries clear. Meant as a rubber glue but water based.

#7

Ok. Looks like old mystery of Noriko glue is solved. This is nothing but CMC based wallpaper glue. Google russian “КМЦ клей” and you would see it in powder form :wink:
Sometimes mixed with PVA to increase strength. I have ordered 100g from China to try. Would update post after testing. I wish I knew it last time I have been in Russia. It costs nothing there.

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#8

Eeew! Another reason why not to eat cake fondant! :smile: But seriously, that´s quite a find! Following.

#9

Try T-88 epoxy glue.
But be patient. It has a 45 minutes open time, and a 7 hours set time, but it is recommended you only remove it from the machine after 24 hours.

#10

Hello Alexey Did the russian “КМЦ клей” glue work the same as Noriko glue?

#11

Ah, This is the main issue. I thought I found an equivalent in Canada, but it did not worked out.
I yet to try the real “КМЦ” but I haven’t been to Russia for a while…

#12

If you can understand Russian can you order it online and have it shipped to you in Canada? I saw several websites selling it, but I didn’t understand Russian. Let me know if you find a Russian site that sells it, but where the website can also show English…

#13

Nobody would ship to Canada, it is a big hassle to ship something internationally for any seller in Russia.
I thought to ask my fiends or relatives to buy it locally and ship it to me but later decided against it as shipping some mystic white powder in a parcel looks quite strange :wink: I am yet to try local sources of wallpaper glues, should be close enough in properties IMHO.

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#14

Interesting. Any particular brand of Wallpaper glue powder that you would recommend? Would that be better than Hide glue?

#15

Hide glue is superior to any rice or wheat glue IMHO.
The only problem with hide glue what it makes skin transparent as well as transfer the color from wood to the skin sometimes.

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