String spacing

Building/Repair
#1

I am seeking wisdom from the shamisages.

First, several references from “Shamisen of Japan”. On the Tenjin Top Template, the inside width between the left and right kuroaze measures 27mm. Then, in the "Koma (bridge) section, Step 14 instructs to “file out 3 notches 9mm apart” in the saddle. Finally, under “Stringing the Shamisen (What I would do)”, is the following text:
“Normally players string the shamisen so the ichi-no-ito is against the left kuroaze, and the san-no-ito is against the right kuroaze, with the ni-no-ito in between. However, supreme shamisen players string their shamisen so the san-no-ito is much closer to the ni-no-ito.”
The last sentence is illustrated by a photo, reproduced here in blatant violation of the book’s copyright notice:

If a shamisen is strung “normally”, with both outer strings against their respective kuroaze, the outer strings will be just about 24mm apart. I have in my possession a koma from an unknown shamisen, which has saddle notches 12mm apart (24mm between the outer strings). The result of using this combination is parallel strings from kamigoma (nut) to koma.

Now suppose the same “normally strung” shamisen is equipped with a koma-per-the-book with 9mm notch spacing (18mm between the outer strings). The resulting string spacing is wider at the kamigoma than at the koma, which seems rather odd.

Presumably, the koma notch spacing specified in the book was selected with “supreme shamisen players” in mind. From the photo, assuming 27mm between the kuroaze, the outer strings scale to ~18mm apart. This matches the 18mm outer string spacing of the koma-per-the-book, and would result in parallel outer strings. However, as the picture shows, the three strings are not evenly spaced at the kamigoma; with equal spacing at the koma, the middle string will not be parallel to the two outer strings. Aside from bothering my sensibilities, this could adversely affect playability.

Would it make more sense to file the koma saddle notches to match the string spacing at the kamigoma (~11mm and 7mm), as shown in the photo?

#2

I don’t know if it would make sense.

Playability varies from player to player,“supreme” players may have more experience,and hand flexibility,so they may be able to play with the san no it closer to the ni no ito.

As I learned,Tsugaru-jamisen Is an uncomplete style,that varies a lot,so,if you do the koma just parallel,it may be easier to some and hard to others,só it males sense,and doenst make sense.

BUT in logical terms,it would make sense and also improve playability.

Sorry,my answers are confusing and sometimes have no sense,because i’m still learn,so…here Is my try!

#3

Im not quite sure. I know the ichi no Ito would have to be moved so it lies over the azuma sawari around the kamigoma. To me it seems like it would make sense to either have the strings parallel or to have them fan out towards the koma.

#4

It would be interesting to have a koma with offset notches. I’m sure it wouldn’t hurt anything.

“However, as the picture shows, the three strings are not evenly spaced at the kamigoma; with equal spacing at the koma, the middle string will not be parallel to the two outer strings. Aside from bothering my sensibilities, this could adversely affect playability.”<

To my knowledge, this is the way it has been done for quite some time, to great effect. A variety of instruments have strings that aren’t perfectly parallel to each other. The length of the string will be altered slightly, yes, but the minute pitch difference it will cause can be offset by tuning it correctly, (besides being, in my opinion, barely noticeable, if at all) and as the shamisen is not a fixed pitch instrument I think if your ear is good you can still find the correct position on the sao anyway. I’ve thought about this before, but never got around to/ been brave enough to file extra notches in my koma. I suppose you could file them and experiment and still have the original notches to go back to, like a 4-notch custom koma? Would be neat.

#5

Nice one, Dan. :wink:

Shinji puts it very well. “Playability varies from player to player,“supreme” players may have more experience,and hand flexibility,so they may be able to play with the san no it closer to the ni no ito.”

Personally, the notches of the koma I had was spaced like that, but there isn’t a measurement set in stone.

Also, like most instruments (like the mandolin or banjo), the spacing at the bridge and nut are often different. For the mandolin, the strings spacing width is about 2" wide at the bridge, and ends up with a width of about 1.25" at the nut. Thus, the same is true for the shamisen.

like a 4-notch custom koma?

That will be made when we design a four string shamisen. :slight_smile: (No joke, it will happen!)

#6

Johnathan,
Another thing would be to invest in several Komas so as to not worry about messing one up just in case. It used to be fairly common that Shamisen players use different Komas for different songs. I do that sometimes too. So it’s important to have pockets full of Komas. Komas coming out of our nose, bathtubs full, U Haul moving trucks filled from top to bottom with Komas! Swimming pools filled with Komas. Rental storage space overflowing with extra Komas!

I’m just kidding of course . But seriously it’s not a bad idea to have extras.

Dan,
Don’t want to offend anyone’s translation of foreign languages but having grown up in Japan and having many close friends who are professional Shamisen players I can tell you with absolute certainty that there is no reason to state that certain ways to string the Shami could be for just “Supreme” players. Although I feel like I can totally understand what they mean to say. When I started taking lessons I had strung everything pretty symmetrically which works well for picking up the basics. Later on, however, I was practicing some 4300 phrases and noticed by chance that it flowed better and had an awesome feeling when I pulled the San no Ito a little To the side to where San and ni become closer (like in the pic)!
Masahiro Nitta and I discussed this once long ago but I always thought of it as simply an observation.

#7

I gotta say I tried moving the san-no-ito closer to the ni-no-ito (like the pic) and I didn’t like the way it felt at all, all comes down to preference I guess.

#8

I want to try out a koma with the san-notch put closer to the ni. I’m currently playing almost like the pic. When I met up with Grant he explained to me that the main benefit of doing this is that you get a larger area to drag your finger/nail off the string when performing hajiki, resulting in better tone. It will also be easier to perform it correctly since the margin is larger. You get the wrong sound if your hajiki is performed by dragging the string until it goes over the edge of the sao. You are supposed to drag the finger off before that happens.

That said, I don’t really have any nails to speak of so my hajiki sucks, but at least I’m giving myself some aid in stringing the san-no-ito like this.

#9

When I met up with Grant he explained to me that the main benefit of doing this is that you get a larger area to drag your finger/nail off the string when performing hajiki, resulting in better tone. It will also be easier to perform it correctly since the margin is larger.

That actually makes a lot of sense.

That will be made when we design a four string shamisen. :slight_smile: (No joke, it will happen!)

Design? You mean like 4 itomaki, a super fancy quadruple looped neo, said extra notched koma, and a slightly wider sao? That would be awesome! XD

#10

like a 4-notch custom koma?

That will be made when we design a four string shamisen. :slight_smile: (No joke, it will happen!)

Really? It sounds really cool,and remembers me from a different type of sanshin, it is called rokushin. You can even imagine the instrument only by the name :stuck_out_tongue:

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